Romney.
What do you think? Does it bother you that he is so ridiculously wealthy? Does it bother you that he only paid (quite legally) only 15.4% tax rate?
I don't love Romney. I don't hate him. (I actually quite liked Huntsman, but we all knew he never really had a chance). I like him more than the rest of the current Republican candidates. I'd vote for him in the primaries (in Virginia those with no party affiliation may vote in either primary. I think). I might vote for him in the general election if he gets the nomination...then again, maybe I'll stick with Nader. I haven't decided. It doesn't bother me that Romney is wealthy or that he paid a smaller percentage of taxes than Obama or Gingrich. It DOES bother me that the current tax system will require that someone like me pay 22-25% taxes, but the millionaires don't because of capital gains or something that I don't really understand (Father or sister, here's your cue to offer a SIMPLE explanation of tax law). It seems the system could use an overhaul. But I don't think that should influence one's opinion of a candidate's politics. Because who would volunteer to pay more taxes than required by law? As long as it's all legal, what's the big deal?
I'm just wondering what you think. Please share. All six of you who still read my blog on occasion.
16 comments:
I DO! I DO! I read your blog!
My thoughts?
1. I don't care what Mitt Romney's tax rate is under the current system. What I care about is the blatant hypocrisy spewing forth from the mouths of his opponents (and their surrogates) about it all. Mitt Romney is a job creator . If he weren't running for president, Newt Gingrich would be licking the bottom of his (Mitt's) feet.
2. I'd like Mitt a heckuvah lot more if he were the same Mitt that ran for governor in Massachusetts. He was more moderate, open-minded, middle-of-the-road, and effective as a leader. The reason all of the talking heads are calling him "soulless" and "empty" and "boring," is because the person he's trying to be IS NOT WHO HE REALLY IS. He's a moderate. He leans left on some issues. He's not totally conservative. That's not where his SOUL is. Therefore, Conservative Mitt = ROBOT. If Massachusetts Mitt were to emerge, he might actually have a shot at beating Barack Obama. Unfortunately, Massachusetts Mitt doesn't have a snowball's chance in a republican primary because they've been hijacked by people so ideologically jammed to the right that they're threatening to throw the earth out of orbit.
3. Have you set your sights on a boston vacation yet?
**SHOOT**
The html didn't like that I put AIRQUOTES around the word "job creator." Oops.
I certainly meant it WITH air quotes....and not as, like, a real thing.
I have no problem whatsoever with Mitt Romney's tax rate or the fact that me made a ton of money in 2010. He paid what he was legally required to and I also don't mind that capital gains rates are significantly lower than the rates on regular wages.
This interesting article points out that Romney actually pays a higher effective federal income tax rate than most Americans:
http://money.cnn.com/2012/01/24/news/economy/Romney_tax_return/index.htm?hpt=hp_t2
Good point, Jen- Massachusetts Mitt would never win the primaries, which is really a shame. Here's hoping that he'll win and then WIN and the real Mitt will emerge.
Trav is insisting on a non-winter trip, so perhaps sometime in spring. So that would be June, right? ;)
My understanding is that the logic behind Capital Gains Tax is that money earned from investments is taxed at a lower rate because you already paid taxes on it once, when you first earned it.
I don't care what Romney paid in taxes -- he paid what the law required him to pay. Not one of us would pay more taxes than we are required to pay. Frankly, I don't see why it is an issue at all.
Another take on his taxes:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/post/romney-paid-42-percent-of-2011-income-in-taxes-and-charity/2012/01/24/gIQAGe4qNQ_blog.html
http://creativelyaccounting.com/?p=179
I also don't care about the taxes, it's legal (wouldn't that be nice to make 21 mil/year?). It really bothers me that people are so up in arms by it all. The guy is smart and successful.
I agree with Jen, it's too bad he's had to become a conservative ROBOT to have a fighting chance in the primaries. Can I just say, the republican mud slinging is driving me nuts!
June is good....it's not blisteringly hot yet...usually. May is gorgeous, though.
Ummmm...if Newt Gingrich wins Florida, mark my words--the Republican establishment is going to panic and they are going to start looking for a late-entry candidate. Newt Gingrich didn't win South Carolina; Mitt Romney LOST South Carolina. This whole shift in momentum has nothing to do with a surge by Newt...but it has EVERYTHING to do with an implosion of Mitt. In a general election I wouldn't vote for either of them....but a Gingrich ticket will be SOOOOOOOOO much easier to say no to.
(A Huntsman ticket? Well, that would have been more difficult, huh.)
(From Joe)
And yet--- it's just the way the system works. There are tax benefits all around. For students, for families, and more. In my experience, people think they pay more than they really pay in Federal income taxes, because we see the marginal tax rate FIRST, but don't consider what it boils down to in the end.
For example, the years we were students? Pretty much $0. The years we had income but qualified for adoption credit? Also $0. Now several years out of college with nothing special in my return but a couple of kids? Our effective tax rate is <7%.
Yes, I like deductions (standard only!), exemptions, and the child tax credit. I'm thinking Buffet's secretary makes some pretty big bucks if her effective tax rate is 25%.
Oh, here is an interesting table that shows how the average tax rates float according to income. On average, families with less than 6 figure incomes (88% of America) don't need to complain at all, since they are well below 10% effective rate.
Thanks for the link, Joe. And I think you're right about the effective tax rate. That's not a number we usually pay attention to, but we should since it's the real amount we're paying.
So reasonable! As always.
I don't care much for Mitt and I concur whole heartedly with Jen's wistfullness for MassMitt. Business background but easy on the "family values". (Not that I hate families. I am in a family myself)
He didn't break any laws and I think it's ridiculous when people find the mere having of wealth distasteful. He worked hard and he worked smart.
John Stewart is quick to say that yes, he makes a lot of money and he wouldn't mind being taxed a little more to help the poor. So perhaps some of the ire comes from people who agree with Stewart and think Romney ought to share more of his wealth?
While I admire Stewart for saying such (and hope he means it) I don't feel strongly that it ought to be compulsory...I've read Ayn Rand.
That being said, I think I'd still vote for higher taxes on the rich than for Romney and certainly Newt.
Brooke, I think you're spot on (as usual). :)
Fautie says:
Fist Mass Mitt would never win the republican nomination. Like it or not it is a game he must play. Nixon said it well really. For the nomination campaign right. To win the presidency move to the middle.
Now Cap gains and dividends 15% rate. Yes the theory is that you invest with after tax dollars so the gain should be taxed at a lower rate. Romney likely paid 35% to 40% on all his earnings that made him a wealthy man. Also, the idea behind a lower cap gain rate is the risk factor. It benefits us overall economically for investors to risk their money. So taxing cap gains at a lower rate helps mitigate those risks. Also keep in mind if you net all your annual capital gains and losses and you have a net loss you only can use $3000 per year of those losses. I have some clients that have hundreds of thousands of capital loss carryover that they may never use unless the sell some stuff at gains to offset the losses.
Now dividends. This is a bit more controversial. Before the big tax cut Bush pushed in the early 2000s dividends were taxed as ordinary income. Many argued that was grossly unfair because dividends are double taxed. This is because the company paying the dividend cannot deduct it. So say Apple pays a dividend. That income was taxed at likely 30%-35%. It pays you a dividend and you pay 15%.
Another thing to keep in mind is that lower income people if they have cap gains pay at 10% and some may even pay at 0%.
No I do not have a problem with Romney paying at the rate the law requires. Personally I would not object if the tax law was changed to impose a say 20% or maybe 25% rate on cap gains for higher income earners.
What Romney needs to say is "Look, I worked hard to get where I am. It is the American dream and is available to everyone. Sure I may have got a better start and we need to look for ways to help those who have less opportunity. But I built a business that facilitated investing in companies that went on to create many jobs. Venture capital is a vital function in our capitalist system. Without it many great companies would never ever make it. Since that time I have invested wisely and pay the required taxes that is imposed on me by law. I am not ashamed of any of this. Nor should anyone be."
All of this is silly and the fact that some of his opponents are making an issue of it is frankly astounding to me.
Honestly, I don't give a hoot about taxes. I read an interesting article that talked about how Mitt is living the American dream and why are people so mad; don't we all want to be rich? Wouldn't you know, some people commented that no, they would not like to be rich, they don't like rich people, so that's why they don't like Mitt. Hmmm.
I read somewhere else (Do you love how I am not giving you the sources for these things I have "read?") that the race for the Republican nomination is like a reverse Sophie's Choice, and I would have to agree. Who do I dislike the least? And then, who is going to be able to beat Obama? Isn't that the whole point.
When I think of Newt Gingrich actually being the president, it just makes me giggle. Maybe I'll just write in T-rav.
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